| Archive for langcafe2.myfreeforum.org Come in and have your daily cup of languages! |
| Porthos |
9-11 was created by the governmentPlease, I urge you to watch this video. You don't have to believe it, but you can at least watch it objectively, and with an open mind.http://video.google.com/videoplay...726&q=9-11+cover+up&hl=en More information: http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/911security.html |
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| KSa |
What makes me sad the most is not people making up such stories but quite significant number of people who believe it.
Of course I didn't watch the video and am not going to. |
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| Losseh |
Hmm... I watched many videos like this and everything I know after watching them is... that we don't know exactly what happened those days. We might be sure that thousands of people died under the ruins of WTC. If the WTC destroying was arranged by US government, it would be sad that the rulers can do such terrible things to reach their targets... If everything happened like it was said in TV it is also sad that human can kill other human just to terror other men... I don't know what to think about that.
BTW. Porthos - Have you seen films about landing on the moon? They are also interesting, however I couldn't find any pictures of these they've shown in these films :wink: |
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| Porthos |
Why be so close minded?Do you think the government is infalliable? Regardless of what party is in power, all political administrations are corupt in some manner or other. And who knows what really goes on behind the scenes. I'm politically neutral, so I don't take a stand with one party or another. I'm not a liberal, I'm not a conservative. My views would be classified as moderate, maybe socially liberal, economically conservative in the U.S. sense of the word, but I don't support any political party.Consider this. It was not in the video. But did you know that Marvin Bush (George W. Bush's younger brother) was in charge of security at the World Trade Center until the day of September 11th? Doesn't that strike you as a bit fishy? That alone should be enough to raise some questions. What about all the put options placed on American and United Airlines and Boeing shortly before 9-11. |
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| Losseh |
1. G.W.Bush said that he had seen the situation when the first aeroplane hit the WTC tower. It's a pity that at that time he had been far from NY. Of course no television channel had shown this situation (as I know there is only one film showing hitting the first tower). Odd situation.
2. Interesting is also this, that on a day the attacks took place, G.W.Bush's administration told us who had been the guilty! How was it possible, when everyone died in planes!?! 3. It's funny, that six men who were to be terrorists weren't on the planes and still live. One of them is in Tunesia. 4. The most spectacular: Have u seen photos of Pentagon after the attack? I find it not to be possible that nothing neighbouring to destroyed segment burnt! But apart from this, the passenger plane that probably hit the Pentagon wouldn't make so little damage.. It's impossible for me but who knows... Inspite of these things, I'm not sure who did the WTC attack... We will never know the truth... It's wise to follow the truth, but not blindly... |
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| greg in noord-frankrijk |
Re: Why be so close minded?
Business as usual. Speculation on commodity (gold, oil...) prices, on financial instruments such as (put/call) options on securities (stocks, bonds...) is rather a tarte à la crème in capitalist countries. As a matter of fact, American Airlines issued a profit warning on 7 September 2001. On 10 September, Goldman Sachs revised their (publicised) expectations on American Airlines' profits downwards. So much for the hot air about the 4.500 put options on American Airlines bought on 10 September in Chicago (4.500 puts vs 750 calls "only"). |
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| fab |
I've read on internet that almost 50% of the American people are now having doubts about the "official theory" concerning september 11th, is it true ?
Is there any mediatic coverage on TVs about this phenomenon ? |
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| Porthos |
Not in the mainstream media. Is that picture of you Fab? | ||
| Deborah |
Do you remember where you read that? I don't think the figure would be that high. |
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| fab |
In those articles it seems that a pool had revealed that 42% of the American people doubt of the official theory:
http://www.voltairenet.org/article139474.html http://www.lefigaro.fr/internatio...00260_l_obsession_du_complot.html http://bellaciao.org/fr/article.php3?id_article=32809 and in a lot of other sites. Do people speak about that ? It seems that if 42% of the people have doubts that it is hard for the "mainstream medias" to avoid the question without accentuate the doubts, no ? Or this number of 42% is false ? For Americans, does it correspond to your opinions or your firends opinions ? or do you think it is a marginal phenomenon that include only some traditional "conspiracy's fanatics" and antisemitic extremists ? I personally have seen a lot of the videos on this subject, as a rational person I find them quite disturbing since they seem very well argumented, much better than the "official theory". If the number of 42% is true, and if the government is not implicated, it canno't not being aware that a big part of its population have doubts. Does the official give clues and argumented answers to the diverses questions that the videos ask ? I was looking on internet for it, and was not able to find it to make my own equilibrated opinion. |
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| Deborah |
I have my doubts, largely because I find our administration so untrustworthy generally. But the reason I think the figure of 42% seems high is that there are so many people in this country who wouldn't dream of questioning what their leaders and the mainstream media tell them. | ||
| greg in noord-frankrijk |
Salut fab et bienvenue à toi sur Langcafé ! :D | ||
| Porthos |
No, 42% sounds far too high, and what Deb said is right on the mark. I would say maybe 5% of Americans at the most really question the official story. There has been no media coverage on the matter, except endless streams of brainwashing from the mainstream media. Anyone who questions the official story is considered unpatriotic by most. |
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| fab |
Salut Greg merci pour l'accueil très sympa !
Es-tu le créateur de ce forum ? |
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| greg in noord-frankrijk |
Non. Le créateur c'est André (in Zuid-Afrika). Il a créé ce nouveau site car l'ancien Langcafé n'était plus opérationnel. L'ancienne version du site actuel était elle-même un rejeton (au départ provisoire) d'Antimoon créé lorsque ce-dernier fut attaqué par des pirates et mis hors-service pendant un certain temps. | ||
| Tiffany |
As a person, I am just appalled that someone out there would ever want to do something as heinous like 9/11. However, just the mere fact that it did happen means there is someone(s) out there that are that heinous. Who? Well, there are a lot of people I don't trust - including my own government. I wouldn't throw any plausible theory out the window, nor would I endorse any as I just don't know.
Personally, I don't think the government as a whole played any direct role in 9/11. Why? Because even though i know there are heinous people out there, it's hard for me to believe there are so many - I simply don't want to. Is it possible that certain individuals did? I believe that to be possible. Did they foresee it and not take the correct measures? Plausible, very plausible. Have they lied to us? Hell yes. Not believing that would be implausible in my opinion. And yes, I question the official theory. |
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| Porthos |
It's good that your mind is open to all possibilities. But consider this, or strive to bury your head in the sand if it pleases you. Marvin Bush was the chief of security at the World Trade Center until the day of the attack! Through September 10th, 2001! That should send bold, flashing, warning signs in your brain! Ding dong! Ding dong! BAM! There's something very fishy about that. What are the chances of that being a coincedence???? As a reasoning person, surely you must see some connection with the administration. :roll: | ||
| Tiffany |
You must have missed the part about believing certain individuals within our government could have been involved. And who talked about the events just being "coincidences"? As a reasoning person, you should be able to see I have my own personal doubts - posted above. I am always open to new views and will form my own opinions on them. Head in the sand? Hardly.
When I say "government as a whole", I mean the entire government - every person. Sure I think it is plausible to say key figures had direct roles. Choreographed? Sure. But I find it hard to believe absolutely everybody in the government played a direct role. |
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| André in Zuid-Afrika |
Actually, no, he wasn't. He used to be a director of a company called Securacom which provided security meas ures at the WTC. He occupied this position from 1993 until 2000, when he left. In other words, when 9/11 happened, he was no longer involved in the company. He was also never chief of security at the WTC, which was one of several clients of Securacom. Don't believe everything you read on the internet.... :wink: |
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| Porthos |
Oh, well then in that case, I certainly agree with you. I sincerely doubt that more than a handful, or a few dozen top government officials knew of it. It was more than likely a conspiracy within the government, from a few whackjob neo-cons, or oil-tycoons, I don't know. But the intent was there, as well as a plausible motive.
Tiffany, how did you get your picture on there? I want to put mine up, but I don't know how. And I don't think I can in any case, because I no longer have e-mail capabilities on my cell phone. |
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| Porthos |
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/911security.html
Yes, well, I was confused with a mixture of information. You are correct. He was not chief of security. But what source tells you that he left his position as director for the security providing firm in the year 2000? |
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| André in Zuid-Afrika |
Hi! Actually I was about to post the link, but you were to quick for me! :lol: Here it is. http://www.populist.com/03.02.burns.html Bush certainly has some questions to answer about this. It seems he tried to hide his brother's former involvement with the company to prevent any embarresment for himself and his family, and in the process abused his powers. The theory that Marvin was chief of security (some websites even called him the owner of the company) came from people misquoting this article without indicating the article as source. I found several websites/blogs quoting verbatim from this article, out of context, without acknowledging the source. (That is plagiarism, regarded as an ultimate sin in journalism.) |
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| Tiffany |
Josh (this is your name right Porthos?),
I uploaded this picture to a personal site of mine and linked it through the avatar feature when I edited my profile. I believe it also gives you the option to upload a picture from your desktop, and from a remote location. So just find a picture, edit your profile (upper right on the screen) to include the picture as your avatar (bottom of the form) and voila! |
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| Benjamin [inactive] |
Register for a free account on www.photobucket.com and upload your photo as an appropriate size. Then insert the URL to it in your profile. | ||
| Porthos |
I know my pic is really stupid, but it's an old one, and the only one I have. my phone doesn't have e-mailing capabilities anymore, so I can't get a picture of my face. Damn it all to hell! I need pics of myself for another site too, and I don't have any. So we will have to make do with a two year old pic, with no face. Sorry you guys! | ||
| Porthos |
Oh I just noticed my old cellphone! That's an ancient stone age one! I have a razor now, but I heard that in Europe, your phones have many more advanced features than ours do, and that new phones, and phone colors are released in Europe before North America for some reason. I wanted to get a blue razor, but it wasn't out in the U.S. yet. About two months ago, all they had here was black, grey, and pink. | ||
| André in Zuid-Afrika |
Razor? :? | ||
| Tiffany |
From: http://www.motorola.com/motoinfo/product/details.jsp?globalObjectId=69 |
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| Porthos |
Yes, me llamo Josh.
Andre, We teenagers online always right "razor". Which is strange, being that most teenagers actually shorten words. I have to remind myself that I'm speaking among adults on this forum sometimes, because I get in the habit of shortening words and avoiding proper punctuation, etc. |
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| Porthos |
Is "Andre" a common name amongst Afrikaaners? I always thought it was a French name, like "Andre le petit" in "Just Visiting". | ||
| André in Zuid-Afrika |
Fairly common, yes. Many Afrikaners have French names (and surnames). (White) Afrikaners are mainly descended from Dutch, German and French (in that order) settlers. |
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| fab |
Concerning the videos that everyone can see about 9/11 you should also see it with a critical vision. Most of those are using propaganda methods too, as well as the (or some of the) "official" medias.
It is important to construct its own opinion trying to analyse rational the things, since the accusation is too important to take a quick-made opinion, it could be dangerous. I tend to think that nowadays we all live in an ocean of information where everyone is trying to influence everyone for goals of power. I think we all have to learn to be critical for everything and not fell in the manipulations that a lot of people can do. But we can also be optimistic and believe that some thrusty people still exist... |
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| Tiffany |
In other words, it's all media in the end - take it with a grain of salt and judge for yourself. |
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| Loic |
Wild conspiracy theories always seem so credible even when they are supported by the flimsiest of evidence. They are sensational; they grab my attention; they may make me question established assumptions; they do not, however, seduce me into believing it hook, line and sinker.
I suppose the mystery over Marvin Bush's involvement is more prosaic: he was embarrassed to have any connection with the 11th September attacks, remote these links might be. But to say that he was behind the scenes and actively co-ordinating all these attacks is stretching it by quite a bit. All of us have an implicit favourite decision already and we'd pounce on any evidence to justify our stand. Both supporters and detractors of the present administration suffer from perceptual blindness in processing the plethora of information that is given to us: we pick and choose, selecting those facts that only go on to reinforce our stand. |
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| Porthos |
Loic, that's what most people do. But by being non-partisian, it helps. My opinion is easily changed, as I allow myself to be open to everything. That's why I can't join any political party, because both sides share equal faults. | ||