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Spain is giving Italy a run for its money
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greg in noord-frankrijk
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 12:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Benjamin wrote:
C'est juste que je ne suis pas convaincu que le monde soit plus sûr avec plus de superpuissances militaires. Une superpuissance militaire et bienveillante a-t-elle existé en histoire ? Je ne le crois pas, et je n'ai aucune raison de penser que l'Europe du 21er siècle sera l'exception.


Tout à fait. C'est pourquoi l'émergence d'un contrepoids militaire aux États-Unis est indispensable. Tu connais cette règle en maths : moins fois moins = plus. D'autre part les États-Unis ont prouvé — avec quelle maestria — à quel point leur autisme et leur incompétence étaient dangereux pour la paix mondiale à long terme. Il est urgent que l'Europe se réveille, car l'Europe au niveau militaire, c'est *zéro* pour l'instant. Donc, sans parler de "superpuissance" militaire, il est grand temps que l'Europe se regarde dans une glace pour constater le niveau d'abaissement dans lequel elle se complaît. Il va sans dire que je ne range pas la France à ce niveau de déchéance. En matière de défense, retrouver un tant soit peu peu de dignité ça veut dire *payer*.
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Uriel
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 4:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Europe is going to have to start fending for itself militarily one day soon -- you may as well start putting the money aside now. while you're at it, you're going to also have to change that attitude so many of you have toward serving in the armed forces -- from finding it declasse and a second-class profession, to extolling the virtues and honor inherent in defending your own people.

If you want to be a true world power -- and you are now poised economically to be one -- you will have to take on the responsibilities of being a military power as well. No more blaming the US for being one-sided and not taking your interests to heart -- you have the wherewithal now to defend those interests yourself. Being a superpower -- and the EU will be nothing less in the coming decades -- means having to have the muscle to back it up. You were given a long reprieve from that responsibility and expense by the fact that the Cold War allowed us to be allies, and divide up the labor -- we used you as a strategic base against the Soviet bloc, and you were content to shelter in our umbrella of power -- plus it gave you ample time and the breathing room to pour your energies and resources into rebuilding your economies and infrastructures after the devastation of WW2.

But now we are diverging in our interests, the Cold War is over, the familiar enemy has evaporated, and our priorities are far out of line with each other. And the US is changing the way its military is deployed as technology improves - since Clinton, we have been closing European bases and streamlining our operations. We no longer need as much close proximity to our targets. This is not just a recent development, since the Iraq War, nor is it dependent on a Bushian neo-con government -- it is just the way it is. So as you become more resentful of our military presence, we are also finding you increasingly irrelevant to our goals. The removal of US forces in Europe will be a mutual one -- and will leave you with a serious vacuum that you will have to fill. You cannot leave yourselves vulnerable. Half a century of relegating to the "dirty work" of defense to those "yokels across the sea" has made you overly idealistic and complacent and unrealistic about what it takes to play political and economic games at this level. It will be good for you to get your hands dirty again, and see what it means to have to make and take responsibility for your own decisions, rather than just playing the blame game with us and luxuriating in your own powerlessness and lack of accountability.[/code]


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